I could not let this gem go. While America preachs free trade, here in New Zealand, we actually practice what we preach. NZ's unemployment rate has been at least a percentage point smaller than the US for at least 5 years. Why weren't all our jobs shipped overseas? Why is our argicultural sector flourishing, while America's needs life (price) supports?

Politic in all countries is just a points scoring match, America seems to take the sport to a whole new level. This thread seems to conform it. Democrats (Republican) howl and scream about a corrupt Republian (Democrat) politician, they are oddly silence when it is a politician from their side. The differences between the both partys is of simliar size as the difference of Coke and Pepsi. But still I am yet to see either side criticise their own guy.

I suppose that politics for you, not a rational debate any where in sight.

You left out the lobbyists, their money,  how the dangle it to influence those politicians, and screw things up even more. If we could get the pharmacutical company and insurance company lobbyiests out of Washington, we might actually get somewhere on a national health plan.

I haven`t read all the post`s here, I`m just going to comment on Glenn Beck.  I`m Canadian, I`m a conservative.  I used to watch Glenn Beck every night when he was on CNN`s Headline news.  9/10, I found myself agreeing with everything he said.  I felt he made compelling argument`s for every one of his issue`s.  He spoke of things I wish my own government would adopt, I liked his direction of thought.

Since then, Glenn has moved to Fox News.  Fox News is not a part of the cable package I subscribe too.  There is not a chance I`m going to pay a couple dollars a month more to have access to that channel.  Bill O`Reilly saw to that. Since Beck has moved to Fox News, Some of his word`s are making my skin crawl.  His comments on Obama, The supposed creation of a civil army and comparison`s to natz germany are sickening.

Glenn Beck used to bring forth very interesting subject`s and issue`s to discuss.  It now looks as if he`s become a conservative attack dog.  His show is taking issue`s and twisting them to suit his political message.  He was alway`s anti Obama on CNN.  Not like the garbage he`s shoveling now.  The "Oligarhy" thing, Anyone can put words togeather and choose letter`s to make another word.  It`s an alphabet.

EDIT:

I just listened to the Glenn Beck radio chat about health care.  The supposed lottery in Canada to see a doctor is complete BULLSHIT.  Anytime I`ve needed to see a doctor, I`ve had an appointment and was seen by a  doctor within a week.

I hope to see that someday.  That`s what America is about to me, Innovation and a desire to succeed and do thing`s no one else has before.

I like being your neighbour.

Po, refrain from using the word logic when posting.  I can't take you seriously when you're butchering the english language so thoroughly.

Reading something, and forming political organizations to implement it are two entirely different things.  One is self education, something you should try at least once before you get your cradle to the grave, one is political activism.  To be active towards a cause, one has to act, not just read about it.

I'm in the kill em all and let God sort em out camp.  I'm as right wing as it gets without being an off his rockers loony toon that wants to return to what we had before the civil war, I may be off my rockers though.  There's one Senator I don't want to personally castrate and bleed dry, he votes no on damn near everything.  If I had to let another live, it would be Lieberman, so take your media centric view and stuff it.  There's a reason the republicans have lost three election cycles in a row despite having a population that identifies as conservative.  They aren't, and we know it.  If they'd lost because the country had shifted liberal, our messiah wouldn't be tanking below 50% before he's even accomplished any of his three catastrophic fuckups.

Location is everything.  Before crying bullshit, actually learn about the subject instead of using your own personal experience as the only guide.  You're one person out of millions.  Gander, NF is the source of the news about lottery systems for physician access.  They have almost no doctors in some of the rural areas, it's become quite the problem here in the US in states like Massachussets as well.

Also, he's a libertarian.  They're like conservatives, except not.  Sort of like the republicans are supposed to be conservatives, except aren't, but socially instead of fiscally.  Perhaps you're just flying off your rocker because he's ragging on the democrats now for the same things he was ragging on Bush for?

I couldn't stand his continuous "I'm not a reporter" dribble, so I never watched him on CNN.  I'm not a retarded three year old, so when someone starts telling me the obvious over and over, I behave like I'm being treated and throw shit at the tv.

Then don't read the posts or take them anyway you want. You're response shows you knew what the hell I meant, so you're educated. Maybe more than I am. Either way, you're intelligent enough to make your own decision on how to respond or not to. As to which  words  I will refrain myself from using, I'll decide that on my own.  I'm refraining right now.

Maybe they wouldn't need to cry 'bullshit' if Beck reported 'both' sides and not just the one he wants to use to scare everybody, which is what I have been saying all along.  Does the perfect health system exist anywhere? No. Is ours broken? Yes. Can it be improved or fixed? Yes. WIll it be perfect? No. Don't like Obama's plan? Call your senator and congressman.

Beck doesn't have to report both sides, It's his show, however he does frequently rail against what bush did, and against republicans but he doesn't have to.

He is anti-govt. not anti democrat.

your saying that if he doesn't give each side equal time then what he says about one side is factually incorrect somehow?

Now I'm crying bullshit.

It's the same rule he applies to the folks he goes after when he insinuates they have things to hide or aren't telling the 'entire' story. You can't have it both ways.  He uses that to imply that they have hidden agendas, etc.  Incorrect? How about misleading and biased and prejudiced? How about unobjective? What's his agenda?  In his admission of being a 'religous nut job' I have to ask if he is acting on a divine revelation he had or a bishop in his church had and what was it? His faith allows for revelations and for them to become part of the doctrine where other faiths believe revelations died with the last apostle.

 In June 9, 1978, a lay Mormon bishop pronounced the new revelation from God that black people could become priests, contradicting a previous revelation to Brigham Young that they could not, which itself contracted the practice of Joseph Smith who earlier had ordained a black man as priest.

I don't know if he's a reporter, journalist, entertainer, or on a mission from God based on a devine revelation.  His statement that the worst possible thing that could happen to him would be to 'return to his heavenly father without honor 'would seem to imply that whatever his faith dictates by divine revelation is what he will and must follow.  Are you being led by a talkshow host, a reporter, or a someone on a religous crusade ? I don't know if he was trying to martyr himself with those statements or just misdirect and he is, bottom line, a network puppet that will fuel whatever fire that  keeps the ratings up. Our society shows that we like the negative, inflammatory stuff. The secrets. The dirty stuff. You wouldn't have so many tabloid papers, TV shows and websites making the money they do if we didn't.  The more 'spectacular' the cover, the more issues they sell.

Reporting both sides is not always good journalism. It gives rise to absurd arguments like the birther conspiracy and the whole "Bush did 9/11" thing. If I say that the world is round, good journalism doesn't mean finding someone who thinks it's flat and interviewing them to counterbalance my opinion.

The problem with Glenn Beck is his theatrics and his network. He's on a self-titled news network but instead of informing people he's enraging and scaring them. If he were on a different station that'd be fine, but when you're on Fox News and you go around digging up race war nonsense and convincing people the government is trying to kill them (unless the government actually were, which it's not right now) you're not a legit source of information.

When I watch Olberman I get similarly turned off. There's also some fat guy on CNN who's very abrasive, I'll try to dig up his name. I'm sure you guys don't like them, but Rachel Maddow and Jon Stewart have much better approaches. I'm even not saying they have better information, but their approach is much more informative and is much less focused on agitating their viewers.

Stewart might require a bit of explanation. His show is a comedy show and the majority of information he offers is not presented in an informative way, but his extended interviews are excellent. There's a reason why Bill Kristol and other conservatives you'd expect to be enormously unpopular with Stewart's audience seek out his show.

Hehe... Oligarchy spelling fail.

John Stewart is awesome. I watch every one of his episodes on hulu.

How many time do u need to shoot this guy... understand, I agree with some of the things you say regarding how he goes about things.

Having said that, really doesn't matter to me, what engrosses me and I'm sure a majority of the audience is what he presents and not how it is presented.

Obama should take comfort that Beck does sometimes come off this way and if Beck was more savvy he would take a more direct, less theatrical route to his ends.

Right now what credibilty he has is definately stiffled some by his presentation. He's shooting himself and giving rise to rampant blogosphere criticism by acting out the way he does.

Perhaps he thinks the facts alone will not substantiate the show and feels compelled to dramatize it, perhaps, but I think any show presenting the same information in a more sane manor would warrant as much viewership.

reeeeeeegardless, it matter not to me, i watch for the punchlines , not the dramatic build up to them.

Once one seperates the two and starts basing their decisions on the material presented, to me at least.. I see a lot of things I do not like.

I'll say this too... There are poor people all over the world, It's a fact of life.. everyone does not get to share the pie. Deal with it.

I would rather live in a country, poor, (and I am) but with a chance at making it big (Via hard work) than any country where the Govt. puts limits on how much I can make and breasts feeds me my choice of doctors, rights and liberties.

Beck is NOT the only one talking about it.

Watch last weeks friday episode and educate yourself.

He may have misspelled it, he may not have. No one will ever truly know... In the end.. does it really matter? Bit petty imo with so many other things at stake.